What's new
Medium Format Forum

Register a free account now!

If you are registered, you get access to the members only section, can participate in the buy & sell second hand forum and last but not least you can reserve your preferred username before someone else takes it.

New CFV 39 MPix back also for 20x cameras

Status
Not open for further replies.
Question for Paul...

Paul --

Thank you for your postings and please do not take this as a bash on Hasselblad...definately not intended as such.

I am curious if there is any chance that we will ever see longer exposure times for the Hasselblad backs? This is the one thing that would move me in the direction of a back...64 seconds is a nice improvement but would like to see at least 3 minutes. My guess is that exposure times have not increased due to noise or other issues within the Hasselblad backs. Any thoughts or comments would be greatly appreciated!

Best regards and thanks -- Bishop
 
michaelhcothran said:
And please excuse my lack of enthusiasm with the new back, but this back insults me.
Click to expand...

I see your point. However, the way I was looking at the situation was that at least Hasselblad came out with SOMETHING for the V-series. Sometimes something is better than nothing.

The 1.5x magnification factor that still exists surprised me. I too was expecting something that didn't have it. When I posted my original message it was before I actually read anything about the back. After reading more on it, though, my enthusiasm disappeared. I too would like something like a 49mm x 49mm sensor, but I really don't see that happening.

I guess we'll just need to wait and see and keep using film for a full-frame 6x6 pictures.
 
However fast technology is improved and developed a larger sensor is not only a matter of just cutting a larger "stamp".
Larger sensors bring higher energy consumption which in turn brings the need for larger batteries.
Noise will go up and will also need to be taken care of.

Research is needed to solve those problems. Production costs will also go up.
The cost of that research has to be regained over ever smaller numbers of backs because the higher endprice will mean less sales.
Despite the fact that many of us comment and ask for a larger sensor how many V sytem users are prepared to hand over 20.000 USD for this priviligee?

I happen to know two interested Hasselblad users who ordered the new CFV-39.
Would they also have ordered their new backs at 14.000 euro (20.000 USD)?
Laws of marketing are inexorable.


Paul
 
"202FA / 203FE and 205FCC camera models need a minor camera modification to use F/FE lenses"

Does this mean the modification is not required if a CF/CFi/CFe lens is used (with the shutter of the lens)?

Are we always talking about the modification "offered" by Hasselblad when the CFV back was released (you know... the one that cancels the ISO setting transfer between an E back and the body... :angry:)?
 
Try to look at this from a different point of view:

With a modified 20X camera you have the option to use F/FE series lenses with a CFV back.

Yes you have to accept that the transmission of the ISO value by E or TCC backs is lost by the modification.

The use the leaf shutter of CF/E/i lenses and a 20X body fitted with a CFV back is only possible with a modified body.
 
michaelhcothran said:
And please excuse my lack of enthusiasm with the new back, but this back insults me. First, and foremost, I see this as a cannibalized digital back, made from parts already on the shelf. No different than what Packard, Hudson, and Studebaker all did as a last ditch effort before they dissolved. Not that Hasselblad is ready to go out of business, but that they threw the wool over our heads, hoping we'd be appeased with a rectangle back rather than a larger square back. Sorry, I'm not.
A larger square sensor would have done it. Losing the 1.5 lens factor would have done it. But I find it an insult to offer us a rectangle sensor for a camera NEVER meant to be turned on its side. Oh! That's right - we have the ability to shoot square if we want. So big deal. What's new about that??? Rectangle backs have long been available.
If Hasselblad wants to grab my attention, and make me want to part with hard-earned money, they'll need to do better - a larger square sensor, and less of a lens factor than 1.5. For now, I'll keep the CFV/V system I have. If I EVER decide to shoot rectangle, it WON'T be with a V body!
Click to expand...

I'm 100% with you here.

Now lets say 'technology' cannot provide a profitable back for the V system besides the 36x36. so what shall 'technology' do? should they not try to sell what they have?

maybe it is time for us to open our eyes and see what all these pseudo-new pseudo-improved products really are...
 
I thought this was a Hoax at first.

I go on vacation, and this happens ... WAHOO!

I still cannot believe my eyes. A dream come true, just when I was happily resigned to living with the CFV-II for the rest of my life.

29 meg square, and 39 meg 1.1X crop factor in landscape orientation is NOT an insult to THIS photographer. Thank you Hasselblad!

(I do not quite grasp why people blame Hasselblad for the lack of a FF, square sensor. IT DOESN'T EXIST, Hasselblad, Phase One, nor any other back maker makes the sensors. Kodak and Dalsa do. Yell at them, not the back makers. (In other words, all the digital backs are using "off the shelf" sensors.) The sensor manufacturers need proof that there is enough volume for such an expensive sensor ... which IMHO doesn't exist nor could be promised by any back maker including Hasselblad.

I still contend that there likely will never be a FF, square sensor ... with the apparent demise of F&H and the Hy6, I am now more sure than I was previously. One can always hope, but in lieu of that, my greatest hope was a CFV back like this one.

This is NOT the same as a Hasselblad CF/CF-II back. It is the only digital back in the world that works fully functional on the 200 series camera, and the only one that works without the use of sync cables from lens to back on any V camera. Not to mention that it is the only digital back that matches the V cameras and preserves it's beauty.

My 203FE is VERY happy about this news. (The 203FE is my favorite MF camera of all time, maybe my favorite camera period). The question now will be whether to convert the 2nd 203FE to digital. These are currently my only V bodies ... on which I use both the 200 and 500 series collection of lenses ... all of which I have kept.


BTW, this back will breath new life into my entire Mamiya RZ system ... I have an adapter to use my CFV-II/16 on this camera ... which does have a rotating back system built into the camera. This provides access to the T/S adapter & SB lens systems, APO long lenses, and speciality lenses like the 180 Soft Focus type lens.


I will place my order tomorrow, even if I have to sell a Kidney to get it.

I will keep the CFV-II as a back-up. Also, for me, this is NOT a replacement for the H system which is more fully automated, integrated and most importantly for some types of work ... is AF! Horses for courses ( BTW, I also use all the 500 series V lenses on a 39 meg H camera, and they are spectacular ... especially the 40 IF and 180/4 ... not to mention the 30/3.5 fisheye which doesn't exist in H/C form).

WAHOO!

-Marc
 
fotografz said:
I go on vacation, and this happens ... WAHOO!

I still cannot believe my eyes. A dream come true, just when I was happily resigned to living with the CFV-II for the rest of my life.

29 meg square, and 39 meg 1.1X crop factor in landscape orientation is NOT an insult to THIS photographer. Thank you Hasselblad!

[...]

I will place my order tomorrow, even if I have to sell a Kidney to get it.

[...]

-Marc
Click to expand...

I agree, the 1.1x crop for landscape would fit me just fine. Remains to be seen what the price will become. Any idea?

A for the kidney: mother nature provided you with a semi-redundant pair for a reason.. ;-)

Wilko
 
Cfv-39 price

wbulte said:
I agree, the 1.1x crop for landscape would fit me just fine. Remains to be seen what the price will become. Any idea?

A for the kidney: mother nature provided you with a semi-redundant pair for a reason.. ;-)

Wilko
Click to expand...


Wilko

Have you been away for holiday ? ? ?
For the price , please read my post #45 .

Jürgen
 
fotografz said:
I go on vacation, and this happens ... WAHOO!

I still cannot believe my eyes. A dream come true, just when I was happily resigned to living with the CFV-II for the rest of my life.
-Marc
Click to expand...


Marc

Nice to have you back here while these exciting things happen .
Many of us appreciate your professional advice very much . So do I .

Taking up Pauls nasty words , I would like to send you for a three month holiday to a place of your choice , and on your return , we might have a bigger square sensor .:)

O.K. No more jokes here .
I am aware , that not everybody in this forum falls in love with the CFV-39
(right away) but for me , a dream comes true .
I could successfully cancel my CFII-39 order and placed an order , just a day after it was announced , for that CFV-39 back .

I do believe , that the american market gets served first , therefore you will get all the backs with TILT SENSOR issues , and we here in Germany will then get the good ones .

HaHa

I am very much looking forward to get that back and I have decided to keep my CFV I and attach it permanenlty to my 905SWC .
I will take that combo out for a walk tomorrow .

Regards Jürgen
 
Paul Claesson HUSA said:
I think the list is pretty comprehensive:
CF/CFE 40 FLE, CFE 40 IF, CFi 50 FLE, CFi/CFE 80, CFi/CFE120, CFi 150, CFE/CFE 180, CFi 250, CFE 250 Sa and CFE 350 Sa

What lenses need to added?
Click to expand...

May I suggest some of the FE lenses--speaking selfishly, for the 150/2.8 and the late revisions for the 110/2 and the 50/2.8 lenses? Seeing a corrected 300/2.8 would be of interest as well.

Paul Claesson HUSA said:
You must manually enter the following information into Phocus:

Focal Lenght
Aperture
Distance to subject

Paul C
Click to expand...

The CFE and FE lenses have some electronic communication with the camera body. Is any lens information (identification, focal length and/or aperture information) preserved in the metadata?

Thanks, Paul,
-Brad
 
bradleygibson said:
The CFE and FE lenses have some electronic communication with the camera body. Is any lens information (identification, focal length and/or aperture information) preserved in the metadata?
Thanks, Paul,
-Brad
Click to expand...

Brad

There is no communication between the lens through the camerabody and the CFV back .
Therefore the digital back knows nothing about the lens , which is attached .
I found no problem with that fact using my CFV so far .

Jürgen
 
In my experience there certainly is some form of communication going on between the lens and the H-series camera body, even if it is simply maximum or current aperture setting information, because my H2 was able to automatically identify many CFE lenses (with the H-to CFV adapter) on mount.

Quite understandable if the 203FE doesn't support this, but doesn't the 203FE support aperture priority metering? If so, there must be some communication in order for the body's internal meter to compensate for selected aperture, for example.

I wonder what other information (if any) is being communicated that could be leveraged?

-Brad
 
Electronic communication

Brad

The CFVI/II and/or the CFV-39 can be used for example with a 501CM or a 503CX or a 500C or with a 201F . (these are examples only) . None of these bodies has any electronic contacts . So , how should any information from a lens with electronic contacts ever get to the digital back ? ? ?
And what about all the lenses , which do not have any contacts ? ? ?
How should any lens information from a view camera lens be transferred to the back ? ? ?

Have a look to the connectivity diagram of the CFV-39 data sheet and you will understand .

Jürgen
 
FE and CFE lenses communicate with the 200 series and the H series bodies but the information is limited to the following:

Maximum aperture of the lens, preset of the aperture, stopped down or not.
Those are the parameters needed to operate the lightmeter of the 200 series bodies.
Could be the focal length is also communicated because that may have influence on the metering system.
Distance set by the focusing mount is not transmitted.

I suppose the metering information of FE and CFE lenses is stored in the digital system of the H series similar to that of H series lenses.
 
Hi, Paul,

Yes, thanks, that makes perfect sense.

It would be great if the CFV39 took advantage of this (somewhat limited) information to ease the process of manual entry for DAC--simply to subject distance wherever possible...

Thanks--the CFV39 looks very interesting. Looking forward to hearing more about it and setting up a test drive.

Take care,
-Brad
 
Read this on the "spec" sheet......

"the cFV-39 will also enable the use of F/FE lenses on
a 200 system camera, provided that the camera is slightly
modified. the modification disables the electronic functions
(isO/contrast) with E-type magazines, after which isO is
simply selected on the camera body instead. "

************
ISO selected on camera BODY(?) Mis-print?? The CFV "housing" does have a series of electrical interconnects, however.

Steve
 
Understanding better

O.K. Guys

I will do a test tomorrow with the 203FE (modified) and a FE lens and give feedback.
Is that O.K. ? ? ?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top