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Questions RE: Hasselblad 201 F vs 2000FC

J

Josef Isayo

New Member
I just picked up a Hasselblad FE 110mm F/2 lens. I am now looking at a Hasselblad F body and would like some opinions.
The two bodies that have interested me are the 201 and 2000FC. Other than the higher shutter speed on the 2000FC,
and much higher cost on the 201, what are the main differences between the two?
I am primarily an available light photographer and plan on shooting mostly wide open with my new 110mm.

Also will my PME 51 prism 80mm CF lens, and acute matter screen work on either camera?

Thanks!


www.josefisayo.com
 
Josef Isayo said:
I just picked up a Hasselblad FE 110mm F/2 lens. I am now looking at a Hasselblad F body and would like some opinions.
The two bodies that have interested me are the 201 and 2000FC. Other than the higher shutter speed on the 2000FC,
and much higher cost on the 201, what are the main differences between the two?
I am primarily an available light photographer and plan on shooting mostly wide open with my new 110mm.

Also will my PME 51 prism 80mm CF lens, and acute matter screen work on either camera?

Thanks!

www.josefisayo.com
Click to expand...

I'd go for a 200 series camera. The 2000 series was not the best of the breed. They have gone through quite a few internal modifications (not visible from the outside that is). Plus that the 200 is much newer. The 2000 are no longer being serviced by Hasselblad.

Wilko
 
F-series cameras

I am sorry to disagree with Wilko on this subject.

Cameras from the 2000 series especially the upgraded ones like the 2000FC/M, the 2000FC/W and the rare 2003FC/W are as reliable as any 200 series camera.

There is one disadvantage:
These cameras have shutter curtains from extremely thin metal foil that can be damaged when a film back is changed without proper care.
To prevent this the shutter opens as soon as the film back is moved away from the body.
That is the reason I do not recommend the first camera from this series the 2000 FC.
That camera does not have this feature.
All cameras from the 200 series have shutters made from textile that will withstand most kinds of abuse.

If your budget allows I would go for a 203FE body.
That will make a good set with the 110FE lens.
Please note depth of field is very limited with the 110 lens wide open.
A good clean 2000 camera starts around 500 euro.
A 201F will set you back about twice that amount.
The 203FE starts at 1400 euro.

Your prism and 80 mm CF lens will function with any F series camera.
On cameras with built in light meter, 203 and 205 models, the CF lens allows use of the light meter in stop down mode.
 
polypal said:
If your budget allows I would go for a 203FE body.
That will make a good set with the 110FE lens.
Please note depth of field is very limited with the 110 lens wide open.
A good clean 2000 camera starts around 500 euro.
A 201F will set you back about twice that amount.
The 203FE starts at 1400 euro.

Your prism and 80 mm CF lens will function with any F series camera.
On cameras with built in light meter, 203 and 205 models, the CF lens allows use of the light meter in stop down mode.
Click to expand...

Very briefly, what are the differences in the 200-series bodies? I understand that the 205 bodies have the zone system metering, and you appear to be saying that the 201 doesn't have a built-in light meter. What other differences exist, TCC vs. FCC vs. F vs. FE, and so on?

I also just bought a really nice 110/2 with data bus contacts, and am considering updating my '66 500C to a 200-series body, perhaps with the intent of later adding a DB to it (what possibilities: CFV, CFV II, P21?, Sinar backs?). I currently have no budget for it, but maybe I can sell something else.

I find the 205FCC very interesting, but apparently there are mixed opinions on it, with some feeling that it is over the top and unnecessary, others feeling that it is the ultimate film MF camera, with the 203FE being the purist's camera?
 
One finger in the 2000FC curtain will kill the body.
With the 2000FCM the curtain remove as you remove a film back.
M mean that the miror is a little longer that allow to view witout vigneting when you use a 150mm or more.
The later 2003FC/W alloy to put a winder to the body and the inside body is painted in "darker" back than previous ones.

In second hand market, the price of a 2000FC is realy low, but in fact, if the old 2000FC realy works fine, it will be safe as others. But never show to a stupid man witch cann not avoid to put finger everywhere.

The 201 has one advantage: it has TTL possibility; but it cann not be modified by Hasselblad for CFV digital back in conjonction with the F lenses.

Other point to consider that I do not know for each model if you use old pistol grip or flash grip. It's a litte different. I had to modify my 202FA to use my pistol grip.
 
All Hasselblad focal plane cameras.

It starts in 1948 with the first Hasselblad camera built for civilian use.
In retrospect we call that camera 1600F after the fastest shutter speed it was supposed to achieve.
Many early Hasselblad cameras did not reach 1/1600 though.

A few years later the improved 1000F appeared. Much stronger, built to last forever which is exactly what many 1000F cameras do now.

In 1957 Hasselblad surprised the world with a new body and lenses all fitted with leaf shutters.
That is the system that is still being produced as the 500 series.

In 1977 Hasselblad offered again a focal plane shutter camera to allow the use of lenses that were at least 1 stop faster.
The first 2000FC camera was offered to the public.
The serie ended late in the eighties with the rare 2003FCW camera.

To fill the gap Hasselblad made the 201F camera.
No longer a metal shutter but a cloth one.
Fastest shutter speed 1/1000, OTF better known as TTL flash metering but still no light meter built in.

The first body with built in light meter is the 205TCC.
It measures 4° of the image with a standard 80 mm lens.
More or less a spotmeter in the practical sense.

The 205 FCC is an improved version of the TCC body with a few extras like more flash facilities and longer shutterspeeds.

Now the 203FE is very sought after. It offers maximum comfort with nearly always perfect light metering that can be used in auto mode as well.

Both 205 bodies are not better bodies just different from the 203FE as far as their light metering is concerned.
The 203FE employs a center weighted measuring system.
The 205 bodies are certainly not over the top but are meant for those who know how to handle spot measurements from an image to set exposure exactly as they want it.
 
polypal said:
The 205 FCC is an improved version of the TCC body with a few extras like more flash facilities and longer shutterspeeds.

Now the 203FE is very sought after. It offers maximum comfort with nearly always perfect light metering that can be used in auto mode as well.
Click to expand...

I have looked around a bit and learned a lot about 2000/200-series Blads since making my first post above, and have a much better idea. These comments also help a lot, thanks. I kinda have the itch to shoot some B&W film again. I used to with my 500C, but the finder is really dim, and the whole film thing meant that when I picked up my first digital in '01, I haven't touched film again until last year, when I bought a Leica M6, while my M8 was being fixed. Now I have very fond memories of the 500C and am thinking of giving the 500C to my cousin, who would most likely love it, and to spring for a focal plane shutter body for myself.

As I see it, the decision matrix breaks down like this:

No metering: 2000FC, 2000FC/M, 2000FCW, 2003FCW, 201F
Metering: 202FA, 203FE, 205TCC, 205FCC

I tend towards metering, but my Lunasix still works, and I am not against using it, if the metering bodies are too pricy. I need to slip this by my girlfriend, so it has to be reasonably priced, ie. significantly less than 1000 Euro (I live in Berlin). It would be best if I would sell something else at the same time :) Of the metering bodies, I presume the 202FA is the only one I might be able to afford. What is a fair price for a chrome 202FA body in great condition with waist-level finder, and a A12 or E12 back? I will start with just the 110/2, so I don't need a lens.

If this is too pricy, I need to consider the non-metering bodies. I presume that due to rarity, it would end up being either a 2000FC or 201F. I don't use flash, and would consider it acceptable to at a later point sell the body and upgrade, if I really got bitten, and wanted a DB or some other higher-end option. I am not against a fragile shutter, but how can I get a known-good 2000FC? What are fair prices for those two bodies, great shape, chrome, with A12 or E12 backs?

Either way, I would want an Acute Matte (plain or D) screen, which I think is not standard with the 2000FC, so that should be factored into the price.

Thanks a lot for all the help.

P.S. I have found two places which claim to be able to fix 2000FC bodies with busted shutters, in case anyone is interested.
 
Focal plane bodies

Hello Carsten,

If looking for a metering body for less than 1000 euro the 202FA is probably your only option.
The 202FA is often looked upon as a lesser camera.
It has certain limitations you will not find with other bodies:
Fastest shutter speed 1/1000, you can only use F,FE,CF/E/i lenses.
In short no "C" lenses with the 202FA.

Auto mode as for the 203FE.
Light metering is center weighed like the 203 FE.
In short the 202FA is a 203 FE with less options.
Still a great camera and a good mate for your 110FE lens.

The main source for 2000 shutter repairs is BRP in England.
Thanks to the initiative of John Emmet many 2000 series bodies are being brought back to live with shutters developed by John.

Of course any other companies that service 2000 cameras can be mentioned here.
That is usefull information for all those who own and use these cameras.
 
polypal said:
If looking for a metering body for less than 1000 euro the 202FA is probably your only option.
Click to expand...

Thanks, that is helpful. I will see if I can find one. I have looked in KEH, Ffordes, eBay, and one or two other places, but so far the prices appear to be a bit higher. Are there other good places to look? If my search is unsuccessful, I am eyeing some 2000FCs, and might pick up one of those.

P.S. It turns out that the two useful links I had for 2000FC shutter both went to BRP, so I guess there is just one. Sorry about the misinformation.
 
I ended up going with a 2000FCW ($570 from KEH) for now since I wanted a 1/2000th shutter speed but didn't want to spend $2,000+ for 203FE until I get used to the new system.

I'm also looking for a good quality adaptor to fit my FE lenses (specifically the FE 110mm) lenses to my Contax 645.
Any advice?

Thanks!


www.josefisayo.com
 
Josef Isayo said:
I ended up going with a 2000FCW ($570 from KEH) for now since I wanted a 1/2000th shutter speed but didn't want to spend $2,000+ for 203FE until I get used to the new system.

I'm also looking for a good quality adaptor to fit my FE lenses (specifically the FE 110mm) lenses to my Contax 645.
Any advice?

Thanks!

www.josefisayo.com
Click to expand...

I posted this in the other thread where you asked, but I will let you know what happens when the apparently good Fotodiox adapter arrives. I also want to put my 110/2 on my Contax 645.
 
Carsten,

You can use your PME51meter prism on any of the bodies that you listed as a possible buy. I personally have the 2000FCM, 201F, and 205TCC body to use with my F lenses (50mm, 80mm, 110mm, & 150mm). In addition I also have the 60-120mm FE and some adapted CZJ 180mm Pre Set Olympia lenses. First body was the 2000FCM. The 205TCC came later as a package deal that had to go to Sweden for an Overhaul. While both camera bodies were in the shop, I was offered the 201F body for a good price. I figure that it would be a newer option to the 2000FCM when it dies.

I also use the PME90 meter on my 201F, as it offers Spot metering and Center Weight. Its a bit of a hassle, as the PME51 is a 45 degree meter.

I back up my meter prism with my Minolta Flash Meter IV.

Evan
 
The Fotodiox adapter arrived, and although I don't have a DB for my Contax 645, it appears to work well at all distances, except that looking far away, I think it may not reach infinity. Even just looking across the courtyard, the bricks are visibly not as sharp as closer, in the viewfinder. This won't be a big deal for me with the 110/2, since I plan to use it close up, but if I do end up picking up a 50/2.8, then I suppose I will have to get a better adapter...
 
2000fcw

I have just read on photo.net that the 2000FCW has a special battery-less mode where it operates like a 500-series camera, if a C lens is mounted. Is this true, is it the only 2000/200-series camera to have this, and are there any limitations (especially wrt. a DB)? What is the worth of such a camera in very good shape (in Germany)?

Thanks in advance.
 
True

Carsten,

Yes that is correct the 2000FCW and the 2003FCW both can be operated without a battery.
Without a battery also the 1/90 shutter speed with the focal plane shutter is available.

Not so easy to say what an excellent 2000FCW is worth.
I have one for sale that has been fully serviced. This 2000FCW has no problem to reach the fastest 1/2000 shutter speed.
The camera comes in original box with a copy of the users manual in German.
Shutter curtains are immaculate like the rest of the camera.

I am open for serious offers over 500 euro.

Paul
 
polypal said:
Yes that is correct the 2000FCW and the 2003FCW both can be operated without a battery. Without a battery also the 1/90 shutter speed with the focal plane shutter is available.
Click to expand...

Just to confirm, so the C lens's leaf shutter will be used for the exposure? This seems like a killer feature, so I am surprised to read that it only works with this camera? I presume it works like this with other 2000/200 cameras when the battery is present?

I need to sell a Contax 645 80/2 lens to fund this purchase (I have two; one a little mintier), but when I have found a buyer, I will contact you again regarding the camera, in case you still have it. In what area of Germany are you (I am in Berlin)?
 
I have the 201F. A couple of reasons I bought it is because it will operate mechanically if the battery fails and you can also use C lenses on it. You can have the use of leaf shutter lenses as well as the F series lenses. I do not think anyone will dispute that the 201F is a solid camera.

I also picked up a PM 51 metered prism but I am not sure if I am going to keep yet. I have two NC2 as well as a waist level finder.


I have a very good hand held meter that gives me spot capability along with center weighted avg is I want it.

I will figure out what works best for me this summer.

I did get the proper lens shade and adapters so I can use all the lenses I have purchased.

My lenses consist of the T* chrome C 80mm 2.8( bought from David Odess, 150mm Chrome C F4, 110mm F 2.8, and the 50mm F 2.8.

Interesting enough, everything has worked well for me so far. I ended up buying a couple of other bodies along the way but sold off those bodies when I found a very clean 201F body. I probably still have stuff I need to get rid of because of course you cannot shoot everything at once.

I did pick up a couple of later model film backs and revisited my film developing skills. I have been shooting outdated B&W film for this purpose.

The 201F can use a digital back but there are cables involved and you will have to use a Leaf shutter or C type based lens to do this.

I did receive a lot of good advice from Poly and others on this website.

Take care,

Jason
 
The strong point of Hasselblad: a good supply of used gear that often changes hands at very friendly prices can also act against it.

Make a good plan based on what you want to do with the equipment and try to stick with it.
Any gear that is found not useful for certain applications can be sold without much problem.

Of course forum members will help point out what they think is the right lens etc. for certain jobs.
A scheme to select focal lenths is one of the things that can be a good help.
There are quite a number of lenses just over the standard length.
Each of them has its own application:

100 mm Low distortion with high resolution. Good companion for the makro lenses

105 mm suitable for registration of the UV spectrum

110 mm F/FE lens many years fastest glass ever in MF

120 mm Makro Planar and its predeccesor the S-Planar
These lenses perform best at short object distance till about 1,5 m

A small view of what optics are available around the standard 80 mm lens.
 
Jason

There is a thread called 2000FCW , opened by myself at the 25.02.2006 .
There I describe an issue with the battery in my 201F .
I bought the 201F new , just about 6 weeks after she came on the market .
You might want to read that thread . The issue is not solved up to now , but can easily be circumvented just by removing the battery when the camera is not used or in "C"-mode .

Jürgen
 
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